How Harris vanquished in the Fox News interview

Brett Baier was out of his league, facing an interviewee who was actually able to do what Trump has tried and failed to do in every combative interview he's done.

Let me first join the chorus of those who called Vice President Harris strong, energetic, and effective in her combative interview with an overly aggressive Brett Baier on Fox News.

Something else, however, struck me as I rewatched it. Harris did what Donald Trump has attempted but pathetically failed to do in challenging interview after challenging interview, most of which crashed and burned over the past 10 years. And in doing so, she showed how presidential she is and how weak and petulent Trump is.

That’s because Harris, from the very beginning, pushed back hard on an adversarial interviewer without losing her cool. She was able to show herself to be strong, and she exposed her interviewer as biased and unfair.

That’s Trump’s goal in interviews, but he’s never been successful—at least to the majority of Americans, including many of his own supporters, who grudgingly admit it—because he bombastically rants, often shutting down the interviewer, coming off as unhinged while insulting the interviewer and turning that person into the victim.

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Harris did exactly the opposite. Baier, aggressive from the start, interrupted her repeatedly, probably expecting her to either crumble or to blow up. She did neither.

She firmly pushed back but remained composed, using phrases like, ”May I please finish?" “in all fairness,” and “with all due respect.” Even as he pushed MAGA talking points, including with graphics and photos and keeping the main focus of the interview on immigration, Baier was put on the defensive a few times, giving Harris a chance to then talk about her economic policy proposals and slam Trump really hard on his lack of solutions and his fascistic rhetoric.

Harris’ prosecutorial skills, the ability to consistently reframe an argument and bring the discussion back to what she’s proposing, were no match for Baier. He increasingly became frustrated in his mission to bait her, getting prickly, and it only made him come off as more unfair and biased.

When Harris, toward the end of the interview, pointed to Trump calling for using the military on “the enemy from within,” which he’s described as “the radical left,” and even used Representatives Adam Schiff and Nancy Pelosi as examples, Baier then went to a clip of Trump supposedly responding to criticism of his comments at a Fox town hall that day.

This became perhaps the most viral moment out of the interview—and it focused on the gross deception that operates at Fox News, a propaganda outfit.

Baier played a truncated version of Trump’s response regarding “the enemy from within,” in which he said, “I’m not threatening” anyone. But in the actual town hall, they played clips of Trump talking about using the military on “the enemy from within” and asked him to respond. He restated what he’s said at his rallies about “the enemy from within” including pointing to the left, Pelosi and Schiff. Baier’s clip cut that part out.

Harris wasn’t having it.

Bret, I’m sorry, and with all due respect, that clip was not what he has been saying about the enemy within that he has repeated when he is speaking about the American people. That’s not what you just showed.

Baier tried to cut her off, but she persisted, raising her voice just enough and rightfully angry—composed anger, which is a good thing to express when you’re 100% right and the other person has engaged in gross deception. Baier just shut up at that point, realizing he was outmatched, letting her go on. She was pretty masterful.

You didn’t show that, and here’s the bottom line: he has repeated it many times. You and I both know that he has talked about turning the American military on the American people; he has talked about going after people who are engaged in peaceful protest. He has talked about locking people up because they disagree with him. This is a democracy and in a democracy, the president of the United States, in the United States of America, should be willing to be able to handle criticism without saying he would lock people up for doing it.

It was stirring and passionate, and you really have to watch the clip to see that. It was the moment that resonated in the entire interview. And it exposed not just Trump but Fox News as a fake news network. Harris also used the line “you and I both know” a few times, and this was very effective. It telegraphed the idea that Fox anchors and interviewers really know the truth but are just part of this sham.

Sure, most Fox viewers are in the tank for Trump, and Harris isn’t going to convince them to vote for her via this interview. But she did some things here that were truly powerful and surely roused the thinking and curiosity of some. First, they saw her as sharp, smart, and in control, not the "stupid," “lethargic” person that Trump has described and which Fox has parroted.

They also got glimpses of truth and may have started to google things, like what did General Milley say about Trump (the former chairman of the Joint Chiefs called him a “fascist”), since they’re not getting that news on Fox.

But the interview has more impact outside of Fox. The clips are everywhere, and they show her fearlessness, underscoring her strengths to anyone who has doubts or is still wavering. In a close election that can make a difference.

And the interview also showed that unlike Trump, Harris can spar with adversarial interviewers without silencing them or insulting them while still pushing back and getting her agenda across—because she’s secure and stable, not weak. That went a long way to showing her as presidential, and, certainly, in these 19 days before the election, it’s exactly the kind of boost—going into the lion’s den and conquering—that keeps her base super-energized .